I’m about to say some things that might just get my Sports Blogosphere membership card taken away. Everyone hates Michael Irvin, and a lot of people like to use “retard” as an insult. I disagree with both… therefore, for that clip, I think Tom Jackson is a Grade A asshole.
We’ll start with “retard,” and, just to forewarn you, I’m stepping up onto a soapbox right about… now.
I know it’s pretty commonly used and accepted, but it makes me cringe every time I hear it. There are people in the world with developmental disabilities (i.e., “retarded), and I think insulting someone by comparing them to someone with a disability is pretty thoughtless and cruel… to the people with the disabilities, that is. They don’t need that. Their condition is not one to be pitied or ridiculed or used as an insult against someone else.
Now, I’m not judging people who use it. I hear it all the time, even from my friends. I just wish they’d reconsider and find something else to say. Lord knows I say some wildly inappropriate things myself, quite often.
But someone on television, someone with a voice that’s heard by that many people definitely should have thought about it beforehand, should know what it means to say that, and should set a better example for people. I don’t have a whole lot of respect left for Tom Jackson.
And here’s the other reason for that… Michael Irvin is not even wrong. To start with, it’s a lame question that has no right or wrong answer, it’s just there to fill time. And Irvin’s answer was perfectly acceptable, perfectly logical and plausible. If Tom Jackson disagrees with him, even on something that inane, he has to call him a “retard” for it? What is his problem?
Is the issue of which Manning brother needed that win the most such an emotional issue? Is that what Tom Jackson is going to get all sensitive about? Why? What was it about Irvin’s answer that he couldn’t handle?
The Dynamic Hispanic Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 4:27 am
Holy shit I missed that comment.
Did he really fucking say that? I cannot believe this shit, that is ridiculous and he should be fucking fired immediately. That is like saying “Are you a fag?” It is basically the same thing. This is ridiculous.
Matt R Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 4:33 am
So let’s get this straight. You have no qualms about getting smashed at a sporting event and elbowing a small child in the face, yet casually asking if someone is retarded offends your sense of decency? Is that correct?
Chunky Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 7:43 am
Most retarded people won’t be offended by that comment because they’re, uh, retarded. What’s the big deal. I’m far more offended by Irvin’s every utterance.
Bish Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 8:12 am
Could not agree more, MJD. There are a million other ways to insult assholes like Michael Irvin (douchebag is among my favorites), but using the word Jackson did isn’t one of them. I know it must be hard as hell for an old-school guy like TJ to sit next to this fuckwit every week and listen to his “I’m louder than you so I make more sense” ramblings, but this was over the line.
I gotta think the elbowing the kid refernece was tongue-in-cheek, right?
Ted Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 8:52 am
You know, if I actually was retarded I’d be pretty upset about being compared to Michael Irvin. Agreed that the Q&A that bought it on was completely innocuous though. I think Jackson just snapped after years of being subjected to Irvin. Seriously, how has this not happened before?
buddy Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 8:59 am
The MJD must be turning into a “politically correct site”. All people are retards in one way or another and I bet TJ’s reference was tongue-in-cheek as well.
Sarcastro Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 9:19 am
I agree with MJD. You shouldn’t go around throwing phrases like “retard”. Mike Irvin should be referred to as “mentally challenged” or the proper clinical term “mongoloid”.
Josh Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 9:25 am
Very much with you on this one. I can’t stand it when people say that.
hairofthedawg Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 9:40 am
“Are you on crack?” would have been more appropriate, but would you mind not calling people Dicks? Maybe genitally challenged or something?
cheers,
Dick
the mighty mjd Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 9:46 am
Matt R: Yes, if you took me seriously that I would elbow a child in the face, then yes, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
Chunky: Are you saying that all people with mental retardation are incapable of understanding things that are said about them? Because that would be very very wrong.
Dick: Sorry.
pete Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:00 am
Tom Jackson said it before he realized it. I was surpised, but I give him a pass. He has no past history (like Micheal Irvin). He will probably skate on it. There was no outcry. If there had been, he would do an appearance with some retarted kids, say the predictable things about how sorry he is blah, blah, blah.
BA Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:12 am
I have a feeling that TJ is just so sick of listening to Irvin scream and yell he just snapped. I mean honestly could you take Irvin screaming in your face like that week after week?
jerloma Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:35 am
I was watching this for some reason (football withdrawal I suppose) and I thought he said that and then I figured I was just hearing things. Anyway, in his defense he wasn’t accusing him of being retarded, only inquuiring about it. Tha’s fucked up.
As for the question, the correct answer is both teams are currently 0-0 and the win was equally as important for both quarterbacks. Of course these guys overanalyze everything so I guess that’s par for the course.
Mr. Bojangles Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:38 am
About once every month, we get a topic where MJD gets offended by someone’s crude, insensitive words, and posts on the subject. Fact is, most of the content of this site can be considered offensive. Case in point, many people wouldn’t find that ‘elbow to the kid’s face’ post funny in any context. It’s an endless twisty line in the sand, but fortunately, Dawg’s “Are you on crack?” comment makes it all worthwhile.
BTW, I use ‘retarded’ all of the time, but then, I’d move the mentally disabled to labor camps with the elderly and homeless, try to get a quick jump on China in the next Cold War.
E-6 Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:41 am
I think “shut the fuck up!!!” followed by a quick backhand across Irvin’s face would’ve been a better reaction. I work with a woman who throws out “mental” as an insult. As in, “I don’t like that girl in accounting. She’s so mental.” I always respond, “Isn’t that a compliment?”
chris Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:43 am
Uh, Irvin’s point was actually pretty good. I was expecting something stupid to come out of his mouth, but he had a decent answer to a frankly irrelevant question.
Johnny Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:45 am
Jackson made a thoughtless, mildly offensive comment in a moment of haste. That’s it, that’s the story - let him apologize and move on. Don’t throw stones when you mentally rape folks with images of dead elk handjobs. Hah, I should press charges for that one.
The Bird Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:07 am
What if TJ said “are you crazy?” There are actually people who suffer from forms of insanity. Is it okay to use that condition as an insult against someone else or is that a condition not to be pitied or ridiculed? Are you equally offended by that phrase, MJD? I am not offended by either, and don’t understnad why this is that big of a big deal. ESPN should tell TJ to watch what he says and we all move on. But maybe I am just is a bad mood because I never got my smorgasboard.
UC Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:27 am
Tom Jackson is just jealous that he’s been shifted to the right side of the set while Irvin gets to sit in the center. His feelings are hurt and he’s a douchebag.
ESPN should wise up and fire both.
BTW, Jackson should have actually said, “Are you on the pipe again?” Now that would have been classic!
Rob Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:32 am
If Tom was a real man, he’d have said that to Rush Limbaugh. Instead he goes after Irvin. Pussy …. or cooter, for those offended by the p-word.
weaz Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:42 am
What happened after the clip ended? Did Irvin ignore him and they just went on with the show? Was there a long, awkward silence?
I don’t think it was offensive, but it’s probably not something you should say to your co-host.
the mighty mjd Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:49 am
I think “crazy” and “retarded” have completely different connotations… It might just be my own personal interpretation, but when I think “crazy,” I think of someone who’s probably legally sane, but has lost it in some way. Tom Cruise would fall into this category. I don’t think of “crazy” and “retarded” in nearly the same way, and my guess is that that’s the case for most people.
And about the comparisons between the things I say here, and what Tom Jackson said… the two examples given were the elbowing of a child, and a dead elk handjob. I don’t know what group of people it is that I’d actually offend with those comments. Maybe you disagree with me, maybe you find the imagery offensive, and that’s fine. I’d certainly understand. But I really don’t think any groups of people are offended by what I said, at least in the two comments mentioned above.
Tom Jackson very clearly offended people with mental retardation. I don’t think that the children or dead elk of the world are affected by what I said. But it’s a fact that there are people in the world with mental retardation who are offended, who are ridiculed, who do feel hurt when the term “retard” is thrown around as an insult. Maybe you just consider it ‘mildly’ offensive, but there are people out there that it hurts in real, tangible ways… it does more than ‘offend’ them, and it isn’t mild.
And believe me, I’m not saying I’m perfect, or that I’m in a position to throw stones… I definitely have said some things here that I regret, just like Tom Jackson did. I never called for him to be fired or anything, but… in light of his apology, I was probably harder on him than I should’ve been.
Bouj Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:52 am
TJ isn’t getting fired because he didn’t inappropriately hug Irvin at a restaurant.
MJD, you made me think of the issue in a new manner. Yes, the choice of insult was unfortunate. “Moron” or “idiot” would have been better. And while Irvin might actually have been making some good points, he has said so many asinine things that he deserved this for all the previous stuff he has spouted.
As for any claims about “being too PC”, we’re talking about MJD here. He’s not exactly Mr. PC. And how far would TJ have had to go for it to be over the line? Calling Irvin a (and I am preemptively apologizing for using these as examples) “a coon” or “dumb (n-bomb)”? “Retard” would probably be about the same level as “fag”, so TJ was likely over the line in his choice of insults.
Adam Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:01 pm
I’ve spent the last couple years working with mentally retarded people, and honestly, the word’s never really bothered me that much. I try to avoid it if I can, but even I slip up and use it when I’m talking to my friends. In general the people using it aren’t trying to insult actual mentally handicapped people (the vast majority of whom don’t really care if they are called retarded, at least in my experience), it’s just become a part of the common lexicon (this is pretty much the same reason that I don’t get all bent out of shape when people call each other “gay” as an insult). It’d be nice if Jackson had found a better word, and he really should know better, but I don’t think this is a huge deal.
Doug Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:25 pm
Calling Irvin retarded and the backlash to it mainly comes from the show that Tom Jackson was on. It’s not just that Jackson is an analyst on ESPN, but they don’t exactly make that show to offend people or to be anywhere close to edgy. If the format were one of those “into your living room just casually kicking it” type deals, then the situation would be entirely different.
KP Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:31 pm
I think Adam is right. I don’t think truly “retarded” people are nearly as offended as you may think. It’s insensitive to say, but come on.
Not to mention MJD’s post completely misrepresented the context of his comment.
“If Tom Jackson disagrees with him, even on something that inane, he has to call him a “retard” for it?”
He asked Irvin, “Are you retarded?”
That’s alot different then calling someone a “retard”
The word RE-TARD is alot more offensive than simply asking a buddy that you are arguing with “are you retarded.”
To come to the conclusion that a guy is an asshole and a dick because he asked his buddy if he’s retarded is pretty ridiculous.
Lighten up buddy, the Chargers won!
Bryan Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:33 pm
After the clip ended I think Irvin probably turned the camera and stated, \”Now I talked to Tom Jackson…. and he TOLD MEEEEE…. I\’m fucking retarded!\” Then he snorted a few lines off the table and called it a day.
Taran Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:47 pm
I have to give TJ a pass here. While “retarded” is a clinically correct term (albeit a contraction), it’s inappropriate to use in this context. I have to imagine that listening to Irvin’s incessant defense of the NFL’s leading jackass (TO) as well as his consistant “if I speak more loudly/over [insert name of other panelist], I’ll be right” attitude, without the benefit of a mute button, that we all have, means you’re going to snap. I’m just surprised that it hasn’t happened sooner. TJ is irked by Irvin’s presence on the set, as well he should be.
Spaceno34 Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 1:54 pm
From my experience, people with disabilites want to be treated like everyone else. Words like retarded didn’t bother them.
I think this is a bigger issue here. Everyone is too sensative these days. You can’t say anything without someone getting offended.
MJD, just follow your point - you hate people calling other people a retard. But do you call people fat? Fat people hate that. What about calling people insane? Again, that offends mentally challenged supporters. There are tons of examples were anything said will offend someone.
Take your elbowing a small child in the face - taking out of context that is offensive to me. Now, in your context it is fine. Bitch slapping a woman in rap is offensive to me.
well, I do understand you sticking up for the mentally challenged (Not Irvin) we all need to be a little thicker skinned.
I do think Irvin has head tramua. Wait, that was just my Eagles hitting him
Mr Furious Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 2:17 pm
Jackson should have actually said, “Are you on the pipe again?” Now that would have been classic!
Perfect!
Just today I was composing a comment on a political blog and “retarded” was the perfect word for what I wanted to say, but I knew I shouldn’t. Went with the old standby…jackass.
Oh, btw MJD, every dead elk I gave a handjob to was offended by your comment.
Chet Copperpot Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 3:10 pm
Your opinion is gay.
del gorky Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 3:31 pm
I think you are picking and choosing what is offensive according to some irrational internal impulses you have and then trying to justify it on the backend with poor reasoning. That IS retarded at its finest. That we live in a society where TJ would even have to issue an apology is a signal of how screwed up our cultural priorities have become. Maybe Jackson should’ve called him a “fuckwit” on live television instead as one poster here called him.
Tom Jackson is a mean person and we don’t like mean people they make me have bad feelings. Grow up and deal with people using a variety of means of expression that may not meet your coddled rarified expectations. Your skins are so thin you all act like you are 9 month’s pregnant.
the mighty mjd Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 5:20 pm
Del, I’ll try real hard to deal with “people using a variety of means of expression,” but does racism fall under that? Sexism? Homophobia? Or just making fun of the disabled? Or maybe it’s just a phrase you came up with so you’d feel OK about insulting people however you felt like, and never having to feel bad about it. And congratulations on sounding really smart.
Spaceno - You’re right, it is a fine line and a slippery slope. Some of the examples you mentioned are pretty valid, others a little more gray… and there are a ton of gray area examples out there, but I don’t think this is one of them. To me, it was clearly wrong… and I think Tom Jackson agrees, and wishes he hadn’t said it. As far as all of us having thicker skin… it’s not my skin or your skin I’m worried about. We aren’t the ones who could be hurt by those words.
grungedave Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:19 pm
I remember watching this live and being in disbelief that Tom Jackson would actually say that… and yet when I hear teenagers or people in their 20s say that phrase, I barely even notice. I guess it’s the fact that Tom Jackson is expected to be “wise” or tactful or something is why we are so bothered by what he said.
I don’t think he should be fired… he didn’t hurt anyone. Or sexually assault/harass anyone.
mrmom61 Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:20 pm
MJD it looks like you struck a nerve. Having worked with people with disabilities for seven years I always hate when I hear the word retarded.In this case I think are you on the pipe again you fucking idiot would have been appropriate.
bmf526 Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:30 pm
I’m not picking on you MJD bbut I am going to say you have said just as terrible things on this blog as Tom Jackson said when asking if Michael Irvin was a “retard”. So I don’t think you have much room to rip apart Jackson since you guys both talk to the public, him on a larger degree, I think at least.
But you do bring up a great point in it being immature and not appropriate at all to use that language on television. I just think you don’t have much room to tear apart TJ because you do provide some pretty vulgar yet awesome humor on this site as well.
theotheruw Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:32 pm
Here’s the question - if someone that was mentally handicapped was nearby, would you say “retard” or “retarded”? I wouldn’t, and that’s why I think TJ was in the wrong (because handicapped people were watching), but he apologized, so whatever.
JDepp Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:32 pm
I have to agree with MJD here. It’s different if someone uses “retarded” as a derogatory term in front of millions on T.V, than it is saying it to a drunk at the bar that just said something stupid.
Having said that, we are talking about former athletes here, not former Pulitzer Prize winners, so I think some forgiveness is warranted.
SmilesD Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:48 pm
After reading this blog for a year or so, I’m having a damn hard time understanding how MJD can complain about the words or phrases one chooses to use. You have some of the most crude comments on the internet here at this site.
Not just MJD, but anybody who complains about stuff like this — grow a pair and deal with the fact that people are going to say things you don’t like.
Ahereeum Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 6:51 pm
Really? Retarded? Man, thats another classic off the list! Can we still say “your momma”? Anyway, the only thing I found offensive was that tan suede suit!
The Bird Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 10:34 pm
I think of “crazy” and “retarded” as basically the same, with “retarded” maybe being only slightly more offensive (though both very low on the offensive scale) due to the fact that people who suffer from some form of mental retardation are more sympathetic than people who suffer from some sort of insanity. People who are mentally retarded have no control over their condition, whereas, on the whole, there is a some societal distrust of the insane, like maybe they caused their own condition via drugs or whatever.
The worst part about all of this is that it makes me wonder if MJD is just stirring the pot like far too many sports writers do. Greg Doyel (and others), I am looking your direction.
Quit messing with my mind MJD!!!!
Andy Says:
September 12th, 2006 at 11:00 pm
On exactly what planet should politically correct speech be considered a horrible sin that a person should be ashamed of? I might run with a bit more “coddled” or “sheltered” or “thin-skinned” crowd than most, but I’ve never heard of anyone ever feeling compelled to say, “Friends, I apologize for the fact that I have never used any historically degrading slurs to insult blacks, Jews, Hispanics, Muslims, women, homosexuals, or the mentally ill. I ask for everyone’s forgiveness, and promise to try harder in the future.”
I can vaguely recall MJD making a joke about Mormons sometime last year, and that’s really the only legitimately offensive thing I can remember. Wanting to choke/have sex with Ann Coulter is on the bubble.
Rhondda Nunes Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 2:50 am
Ugh…I don’t wanna go near Ann Coulter.Not in person or in any enclosed intellectual space resembling my mind.
To hold MJD to a higher standard than ESPN?
Oh C’mon. Talk about needing to lighten up. After all, we’re talking about a website that when I first logged onto it was sponsored by Anna K’s..uh…butt.
The blogosphere’s not the Edward R. murrow CBS News. it ain’t even Katie C’s CBS evening news…
Would you want the voices at slate.com to sound like the New York Times Online?
or the Daily Kos to be like CNN?
Truth be told I don’t like irvine just because of things like his T.O. rantings, so if ANYONE could deserve it…hey, whatever;
But i like the pipe theme. maybe a variation:
T.J:”Are you on the pipe again?I thought you gave that up after you stopped hangin’ with Fergie”
(Of Black-Eyed-Peas fame, for those of you that have been living in north Korea. There. I’ve insuted all North koreans. Do you REALLY take me seriously?)
Go ahead, pick on addicts instead. They deserve it since they choose their addictions, right?
Matt R Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 3:15 am
I commented sarcasticly last night about MJD being upset with the word ‘retard’ and his previous post about elbowing small children. To be clear to MJD, I knew he was joking about the elbowing thing. And to be clear about myself, I could care less what term anyone uses about anything. I’ve got thick skin.
But what really interested me is that I came back tonight and saw 40-some comments on the post. I don’t come here everyday, but I do come 3-4 times a week. I’m thinking this post might be among the most commented on in MJD history. Is that correct?
So why would such a trivial (my opinion) thing get so much of a response? My guess is that the word “retard” seems to be one of those borderline offensive words. No ones real sure about it. When Ozzie Guillen uses the word “fag” or when Marge Schott uses the word “nigger”, everyone knows it’s wrong - end of discussion.
That’s what intersts me about this whole “retard” thing. It seems as though it’s half and half. I just wonder if the pendulum bell in this PC movement we’re in has swung far enough to start heading in the other direction or if it still has a ways to go. I imagine a term borderline term like “retard” just may give us that answer.
Any thoughts?
Spaceno34 Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 11:11 am
MJD,
Not a problem and I respect your opinion on this.
As long as we can all agree that Irvin is a tool it’s cool. And like you said, Jackson has apologized.
Spaceno34 Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 11:16 am
Andy you wrote - “On exactly what planet should politically correct speech be considered a horrible sin that a person should be ashamed of? ”
How about when they change history? An example is that they are rewritten text books (in Texas of all places) about the story of the Alamo. Now, they weren’t butchered and killed by the Mexican army. It was all a misunderstanding. They don’t want to offend hispanics.
Changing literature books because some words are offensive in there are some other easy examples. Anytime you change something from the past, you lose the example and meaning of what was taking place than.
But this is a sports blog not political and we should be talking about how Brad Lidge is just a shell of a man because of Lord Albert. I wonder if Brad wakes up a night and cries thinking playing St Louis.
good2bme Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 12:27 pm
To call Irwin “retarded” was just totally inappropriate. I think by now everyone should be aware that the appropriate term for him is “Assclown”.
I demand that Tom Jackson come forward and admit his mistake immediately and reinstate Mr.Irwin’s hard earned and much deserved “Assclown” title.
Sincerely,
George W.Bush, Chairman
American Society of Assclown Advancement
naturallight Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 2:33 pm
Dude, mentally handicapped people call each other “retarded” when one of them does something dumb. I can’t imagine they would find Jackson’s comment offensive.
Spulture Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 7:24 pm
I’d say 9 out of 10 guys on the internet can make an fairly entertaining post about jacking off an elk or elbowing a kid in the skull…but not many could also go out and make a decent, well-thought out point about something like this without coming off like a total moron. And that’s what makes your blog worth reading.
That said, I don’t really agree with you. This should have been a non-story. At least I haven’t heard anyone shitting their own pants because they are so worked up about it, unlike the great Green Bay Moon incident, which was totally harmless. Jackson acted without thinking, but that hardly makes him an idiot. And like the guy above says, mentally challenged people do use the word all the time…I was in a relationship with a girl who taught the disabled for years…and I have a family member who’s disabled. I can’t imagine too many people were truly offended. More peple are probably offended on a regular basis by the fact that they keep Berman and Theisman on the air.
David Says:
September 13th, 2006 at 11:04 pm
…..and you recover by calling him a dick…………..nice one
charlie Says:
September 15th, 2006 at 12:17 am
I brought up the same issue on my blog (but with only 4 comments… hmmm need much PR). My stance is using “retarded” is funny, but I would never use it around someone I didn’t know (and thus didn’t know I wasn’t a mental handicap hater). I guess then this means I am against a guy on TV saying it, but I can’t help but feel hypocritical criticizing him for it.
charllie Says:
September 15th, 2006 at 1:52 pm
hah i didnt notice it until now, but my favorite part of this clip is the total double take that ditka does immediately after tj drops it. check it out
Bigtru Says:
October 1st, 2006 at 1:02 pm
Uncle Tom Jackson was not so demonstrative when rush was his co-analyst. Irvin is mediocre in my opinion,however, so are the rest of them. This also includes the stumbling, bumbling, rumbling one himself. Right down to the ugly ties he sports. Tell uncle tom to pick bigger targets one with more gravitaus, not Irvin that is too easy.